44-46deg PW's, mizuno........ WHHHHHHYYYYYYYYY

[reg]

Come on, don't be like every other manufacturer who is having a race to see who can release the first set of irons with a PW that is below 40 degrees.

Saw some detail about the 63's and 53's saying they will have 46deg PW's, seriously, they are MP irons, as well as the jpx's with a 44 PW.

Mizuno doesn't need to do these stupid tricks just because every other company does. Don't punish everyone because someone isn't knowledgable enough to know why they are hitting a set of clubs so far.

I want a real PW, not a 9i with a "P" on the sole.

It's not far off reaching the point that you will have to carry 2 gap wedges.

And thats my rant, 46.5" drivers and 43deg PW's are my major gripe at the moment, I've always used Titleist and Mizuno gear and thought highly of them for not releasing the crap that Taylor Made and Callaway produces, but that's now been dented for me.

 

[BigPete]

I don't see why this is a problem at all. So a clubs loft is 2* stronger than it was 30 years ago? Doesn't bother me in the slightest.

I did bend my pitching wedge to 49* to sort out distance gaps but might've gone the other way and added a wedge.

 

[DCB]

It's not new, it's been going on for a fair while now. Mizuno have done this before so it's not jsut other manufacturers who have reduced the loft on their 6-PW.

I've had MP30s and MP57s where the PW is 47° and used MX900 where its 46° Ive just been playing anold set of Maxfli revolutions where the PW was 48°.

It does just seem to be 6-PW that most manufacturesr play with the loft on.

Market driven probably, we all want to hit the ball further, only, we cant really admit what the truthful distance really is .... ;-)

 

[mjtoal]

I think this is a bad move. It forces you to buy an extra wedge. Gee, I wonder why they are doing it?

 

[deano9]

So what degree should a pitching wedge be?

 

[reg]

I think 47-49 is what a PW should be, GI sets tend to cheat with lower lofts to make people think the club is amazing that it can go 15m further than your previous set.

It affects distance gaps between all your irons, especially your wedge set up to get consistent gaps.

I know they try to justify it by saying with new technology and launch from an improved centre of gravity, bla, bla, bla. It's just a marketing scam.

 

[Deemac]

I don't see why this is a problem at all. So a clubs loft is 2* stronger than it was 30 years ago? Doesn't bother me in the slightest.

I did bend my pitching wedge to 49* to sort out distance gaps but might've gone the other way and added a wedge.

Bending the loft affects the bounce angle - so it's a LAST resort to bend lofts!!

48deg pitching wedge is optimal IMHO...

D.

 

[BigPete]

I like 49* and don't mind 2* extra bounce - thanks for the info though.

It seems you really have it in for my wedge choices

 

[mizunofightsback]

I think in alot of cases when manuf. work on getting the center of gravity so low, it might require a change in lofts so the ball won't launch too high. Its no big deal. Figure out how far you hit each club- and your off.

 

[Deemac]

It seems you really have it in for my wedge choices

Not at all!!!

 

[BigPete]

It seems you really have it in for my wedge choices

Not at all!!!

OK I have a question - will there be a gap wedge available in the jpx800 pros in UK?

OK - I have a question... WHY???

Why would you want a gap wedge dictated to you at a specific loft/bounce angle, when there are MP wedges available where you can choose the loft/bounce that suits your course conditions and/or your swing dynamics better??

One can develop a complex you know

 

[reg]

I don't see why this is a problem at all. So a clubs loft is 2* stronger than it was 30 years ago? Doesn't bother me in the slightest.

I did bend my pitching wedge to 49* to sort out distance gaps but might've gone the other way and added a wedge.

People need to know it is a problem, having a 43 PW and then a 52 GW leaves 9 deg between clubs, to squeeze a 43 PW the rest of the clubs probably have a 3deg gap, that's a 3 club difference between wedges.

No improved launch angle or COG is going to help you when you get within 100m of the green and your wedge lofts are all over the place.

Hope this doesn't come off as rude but you proved my point by bending your PW to 49, which as mentioned changes the bounce, I think it also makes the offset look weird.

With the new 46 loft bending to 49 is pushing it.

 

[Dutchonpar]

Strongly agree, don't make the lofts stronger (on MP irons).

1. On the short irons the gap between pitching wedge and Gap or SW becomes too wide.
2. Having the pitching wedge go high up in the air is a good thing (soft landings)

Players seeking more length with their short irons, should look for better shafts. Clubs with "traditional lofts" and shafts that suit you will lower scores more than stronger lofted lofted clubs with non-optimal shaft.

 

[BigPete]

Look - for me - as long as you know what the lofts are, then they are just numbers. So these days a 4-gw is equivalent to the old 3-pw?
That's why I asked if a GW would be available in the other thread.

I tend to work out my club / wedge spacing on distance on a full shot rather than a number on the club - to me that doesn't matter.

Also now that virtually every other manufacturer is using strong lofts it's just simply the case that a modern pitching wedge is closer to 45*. (Titleist AP1 = 45*)
They can't have ppl saying "I like Mizuno but they don't go as far as my superhyperduperlaunch clubs"

Let's face it - 90% of the club buying public are impressed by distance in their irons - it's the main selling point for almost every iron (at least the GI ones)

The general golfing public won't buy a set of irons if they feel they're losing 20 yards on their previous set. The marketing people will only let the clubmakers be "traditional" up to a point.

 

[Terry]

I would be interested in comments from Mizuno on this subject as I have struggled with the arguement that you just use an eight instead of a nine etc. I believe there is more than the loft at issue here as the shaft lengths have a bearing. eg if you normally use a 49 degree PW for 100 and change sets where the PW is 46 degree but they have the same length shaft you may find that the GW which is 49 in the set has a shorter shaft than that in the 49 PW thereby changing swing speed.
I note that TM. titliest,Mizuno etc. all have different shaft lengths for the same club in standard format. Even when you are fitted how do they determine the length shaft for the 5 iron as against the 6 iron ans so forth .
Does this make sense

 

[MPX]

I think Grilled Cheese could explain the thinking better - but here's my go.

- The MP's are about as weak as we can get away with nowdays. It wouldn't make a lot of sense for us to be a club shorter than all of our competitors. So much comes down to comparitive testing (Golf Digest etc ). The market standard has changed - Mizuno has had to follow suit. Plus as so many sets start from 4 iron (even with better players), 4-PW + GW is same amount of clubs as the old 3-PW.

Also, if you add loft to a standard wedge, you decrease the offset (which better players prefer). If you decrease loft, you add offset. So we need wedges where the only custom loft adjustment likely would be adding loft - hence going a touch stronger.

With JPX its a whole different set of parameters. The Centre of Gravity is so different, the lofts need to be different to achieve the desired ball flight, peak trajectory etc. The design is so different, you couldn't have the same lofts or the ball would just ballon.

 

[Alastair Gibson]

MPX,

Im afraid your answer makes little sense to me.

As a leftie you are now offering a 46 degree pitching wedge and a 52 degree gap.

Can you explain to me how i am supposed to bridge that gap without bending a wedge to stronger loft or leaving myself a 5 or 6 degree gap either between 9-pw or pw(46)-52???! (which you have just stated is not advisable!!

Quick answer is that i cant!!

Simple answer appears to be that lefties are now considered an after thought!

Sorry if i seem a bit fed up but i am a very loyal customer having absolutely everything in my bag blue and white and im getting to the stage where i just dont see your company offering me products i can buy!

Not trying to be rude or arguementative

Al

 

[BigPete]

So JPX wedges ARE available - good call - and good loft spacing - 49* 55* 60*

Looks like they may be available lefty shock horror - I guess that makes em cast though eh?

 

[Draghook]

From MPX's answer i think that means you can weaken the PW by 2 degrees to a 48. Just 4 degrees between the left handed PW and GW then?

 

[reg]

MPX,

Im afraid your answer makes little sense to me.

As a leftie you are now offering a 46 degree pitching wedge and a 52 degree gap.

Can you explain to me how i am supposed to bridge that gap without bending a wedge to stronger loft or leaving myself a 5 or 6 degree gap either between 9-pw or pw(46)-52???! (which you have just stated is not advisable!!

Quick answer is that i cant!!

Simple answer appears to be that lefties are now considered an after thought!

Sorry if i seem a bit fed up but i am a very loyal customer having absolutely everything in my bag blue and white and im getting to the stage where i just dont see your company offering me products i can buy!

Not trying to be rude or arguementative

Al

I feel the exact same way, if Mizuno are going to continue to make 46 PW's then they need to start making 50 deg wedges in LH. In 3yrs everyone will have to carry 2 gap wedges, one of those wedges will have to be called something else, how about it being a UC wedge, UC for "Unnecessary Club" due to strong lofts.

Give us back our pitching wedge